How would you define:

[Highway23]

A band that is a 'sell-out'?

I am planning on doing a paper defining the term 'sell-out' in the music industry. And right now I kinda have some ideas on how I am going to define it, but I would like to hear some of yer comments on it. Thanks :)

"But if I call you out of habit I'm out of love and I gotta have it" -A.Rose

[ProfessorFrink]

I'm not really sure what a sell-out is. but my best guess would be a band that writes songs for the sole intention of selling records.

[Smirks]

I think you're on the right track here PF, but I think it's a little deeper than that.

I think a band would be called a sell-out when it makes decisions based on what makes them the most money. Whether it's performing at a certian place, or selling rights to their songs for comercials/movies/tv... you know, stuff along those lines.

[Highway23]

Yeah, those are along the lines that I am planning on going. Where the money is going, and things like that. They are entertainers, and they do need to make money to get by. But how far is too far? Videos, releases, singles, and shit like that can add to the view of some fans that the band is 'selling out'.

Take the history of Green Day for instance. They were a small time 'punk' band of sorts, and they had a small following. They were on a small independent label for awhile, and then when they decided to do a major label deal, many of their followers deamed them as being 'sell outs.' So I think that it would also depend on where the band starts off, and what the mentality of the fans are as well.

"But if I call you out of habit I'm out of love and I gotta have it" -A.Rose

[jamijams]

green day....i watched their behind the music or whatever...and it was interesting to see how many had shunned them when they signed to a label, even though their philosophy had not changed.
i think when your "band" appears in a commercial for chili's baby-back ribs, you should be forced to have a tattoo reading 'completely sold-out, only in it for the money' on your chest. if i hear that commercial one more time, i may open a vein...........

Tell me,and I will forget. Show me,and I will remember. Involve me,and I will understand.~Confucius

[jamijams]

i think if you have a doll of yourself, you've definitely sold out.

Tell me,and I will forget. Show me,and I will remember. Involve me,and I will understand.~Confucius

[Highway23]

hehehe

"But if I call you out of habit I'm out of love and I gotta have it" -A.Rose

[Smirks]

Yea, it's all relative.... lately I have been seing sell-out-like qualites from a band alot of people like around here: Dave Matthews Band.

My gf happens to be as fanatical about DMB as I am about PJ, and she's been feeling like Dave is on his way to selling out big time.

She (and I) are starting to see signs that point to that conclustion....

ie-
1) DMB orginally submitted an album known as "The Lillywhite Sessions" to RCA. RCA didn't like it and forced them to re-record. Everyday was the result of that push. Having listened to both albums extensivly the Littlywhites is far superior to Everyday (as far as DMB is concerned). It seems as if DMB went along w/ RCA because they wanted many hits. So far there have been three hits on that album (I Did It, Space Between & Everyday).

2) After the release of Everyday DMB has made videos for each of their hits. Now, that doesn't say alot because DMB has been known to make videos, unlike PJ. BUT, DMB has appeared on TRL several times since Everyday's release.

3) Massive radio air-time. Before Everyday's release I'd say hearing DMB on the radio was about as common as hearing PJ. After Everyday's release I've been hearing them ALOT more, especially the 3 hits from Everyday.

4) Black Hawk Down - Space Between is on the trailer, I know you've all seen it.

5) DMB is an opening act for the Olympics.

Now, by saying these things I realize there will probably be some criticism from people. But, before you criticize me... I am a DMB fan, despite these "signs" of selling out. In fact, I will be seeing DMB twice on their spring tour and I am VERY excited about this. I haven't been this excited about seeing a concert since the 2000 PJ tour.

There you have it....

/images/smile.gif

[Highway23]

Thanks Chris, those are some good points.

I'm not a Dave fan. And I have heard the same thing about the other album that wasn't released. That is a shame.

I just think that his songs (most of them) have been written to just sound like sappy love songs or feel-good get high songs.

I think I read that the album before this..don't know what it was...Dave had written most of the songs in a one-day span. 7-10 songs in one day? I think that is kinda saying that you really can put anything out and people are going to listen to it and buy the album just because it's DMB. I think that is pretty sad, because I know the guys in the band have talent, but I think that they really get away with putting out crap.



Now Dave with Tim was amazing. Though I don't like Dave's voice, I think that Tim Reynolds is simply amazing and brings out the best in Dave.

"But if I call you out of habit I'm out of love and I gotta have it" -A.Rose

[margaret ann]

The music industry is a business, the point being to sell records and make a profit. People who work in other industries are considered successful if they move millions of units of their product. Actors aren't considered sell outs if they appear a box office smash hit or if they do commercials for cleaning products or soft drinks. Maybe the question should be, why would a band be considered to be compromising their beliefs or credibility because they try to be successful? Is it when they are perceived to create material that would appeal to a vast audience and be commercially successful and have that be their only goal, rather than create whatever and try to get people to listen to that. And that may be hugely popular and commercially successful, but because they weren't perceived to have created it solely for that purpose, then they aren't deemed a sell-out. I think the term sell-out is a subjective categorization. There aren't going to be standards to judge whether a band is a sell-out or not. So the definition you use will apply to what you see as selling out, but maybe not what someone would consider selling out.

[baccusgrrl]

C-R-E-E-D
Oh wait!
That's my definition for a rip-off suck-ass band, sorry!

You must BE the change you wish to see in the World
-Mahatma Gandhi

[yer ardy]

iggy pop answered a question
regarding "selling out" his song
'lust for life' for that car commercial...
he said he didn't consider it selling out
because the song wasn't "conceived commercially..."
something like that...it made sense to me...
but then again, i dig iggy a lot.. a LOT a lot... /images/smile.gif

~my~ definition of a sell-out is a singer/band
who has reached $$$mega stardom$$$ yet is compelled or
is guided to do commercials/endorsements....
what for? the money? like they don't have enough?
examples:
nsync - chili's restaurants
britney - pepsi
garth brooks - for whatever it is he was in a commercial for....

maybe it's not really a sell-out, but just plain annoying...

(reminder, this is my opinion, doesn't mean it's correct...)


"..don't hate me because ~you're~ beautiful..."

[ProfessorFrink]

I never knew what to think of DMB. I liked a few of their songs but I never bought any of their albums or anything. and then I heard about the whole Lillywhite/Everyday issue and I was totally turned off. I didn't think that they needed money that badly.

[RogueTrader]

It would seem that the most obvious definition of 'sell out' is to expose a certain idea and to then back flip seemingly due to a desire for cash. It's in the term....you seel out a principle...you put it up for sale when it never was before. There definately has to be a transition from state to another.

For this reason, I don't think that bands like N'Sync and O-Town or people like Brittney are sell outs. They have never professed to want to be anything other than what they are. They are pop misicialns and i think they are quite proud to admit it.

If you simply say that because someone is huge, they are a sell out, then that Definition means that U2 are sell outs. I don't think they are by any means, yet they contibute the most to the Irish GDP after the sale of Guiness (ie no 2).

I think the Dead Kennedys and in particular Jello Biafra have 'sold out'. They were fircely anti-corporate and their music was about togetherness and not being part of the machinery of the state...yet they are currently embroiled in copyright dispute over who owns the songs and has the right to publish the back catalogue as a greatest hits album.

i thinnk Billy Joel sold out. He used to make soulful music from the heart, but ever since that attrocious 'He Didn't start the fire' song its been down hill and all about the cash.

I think Robert DeNiro sold out. I think that he used to be one of the best character actors around, but now he only seems to be about making action movies which don't stretch him at all...he's been phoninng it in for years.

I think Tim Burton sold his soul to hollywood to make 'Planet of the Apes'. He would never have let a studio interfere with a movie oin such a way in the past, but I think he was blinded by the dollars.

There are lots of examples of performers who used to be about performing and getting the juice from that. Many of them have simply thrown their hands up and allowed themselves to be pushed along by the current. They've done their years of struggle and spent their integrity....Now they want a comfortable lifestyle.

M



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Howard Roark laughed......

[luv2rok]

Sell Out....http://www.kisssuperstore.com/grafx/kiss.gif

Pearl Jam ..............."The Other White Meat"

[RogueTrader]

Kiss is DEFINATELY not a sell out band. They have always professed to be cock rock gods and never told anyone that they didn't want some cash!!!

Ace Freahley Rocks!!!

M

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Howard Roark laughed......

[baccusgrrl]

I agree, Rogue.....
I HATE BRITNEY and all the "boy bands"...
I love U2 and although I can't even keep food down if someone pops in "Pop" they are 10% of Irelands GNP and I STILL think they rock.
HOWEVER.........
I am A HUGE HUGE Tim Burton freak but.......Planet of the Apes was horrid, not even Danny Elfman could help him from succumbing to the monster.



You must BE the change you wish to see in the World
-Mahatma Gandhi

[rockrighter]

Jake. . . hands too cold to type decent answer. . . will pm you tomorrow. . . damn this hurts.

speech gets harder. . . there's no sense in writing